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Acceptable Naked Child Images?
Having just read a very interesting article currently running in alt.uk.law usenet group, I thought I'd open the discussion up right here on now public.
The title of the post in question is: Johnson's Baby Wipes and Child Pornography / Child Prostitution
The writer of the article feels the same way about his subject that I feel when I watch this type of advertising on the TV.
The TV advertising always features a naked baby and as far as I know always a mother.
In some adverts the screen mother can be seen patting a naked babies bottom and even kissing its clean bum, remember, its all to sell baby wipes. The baby of course is far to young to have an opinion or even to know that its naked image is being shown in millions of peoples homes worldwide.
Another thought;
Take the mother out of the advert and replace her with the Dad figure, The Dad can be seen patting and kissing a babies bottom, would that be acceptable to you?
Julia Somerville defends 'innocent family photos'
Independent, The (London) , Nov 5, 1995 by Rebecca FowlerIS IT every parent's nightmare, or is it simply the best way to protect children? The arrest of newsreader Julia Somerville over allegedly indecent photographs of her seven-year-old daughter has opened the debate this weekend on the law relating to child pornography.
Ms Somerville, 48, and her architect boyfriend Jeremy Dixon, 56, were questioned by Scotland Yard's child-pornography unit on Thursday night, after Mr Dixon was met by detectives at a London chemist. He had gone to pick up what the couple insist were "family photographs".
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itslefty
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Most RecentMost Recommended Comments (24)
at 06:08 on March 31st, 2009
I just don't accept that all photos of children are sexualized. Because they're not.
at 06:37 on March 31st, 2009
What age would you decide is an unacceptable age for child nudity on TV advertising?
at 06:15 on March 31st, 2009
I think this is over the top, nothing wrong here with Baby wipe adds.
Nothing wrong with nudity either.
My kids went naked to the beach until they where about 10 and they wanted to put on bathing suits by that age.
at 06:52 on March 31st, 2009
What you think is acceptable and what a pervert thinks are two different views, should we pander to the whims of perverts because we think its acceptable?
There is a story on NP titled "When Flirting Becomes Pornography"
"A 14-year-old New Jersey girl faces charges of child pornography for posting nude pictures of herself on MySpace, and if convicted she could be forced to register as a sex offender. Apparently, the young lady posted the photos so her boyfriend could see them."
at 06:53 on March 31st, 2009
Should we make our life based on the guide lines of fear or should we live our lives and go after those that are "perverts" as you say.?
at 06:58 on March 31st, 2009
If I made a video of myself kissing a babies bottom and uploaded it onto you tube, how long do you think it would be on you tube before the police came over to my home and searched my computer.
It is either acceptable or it is'nt, that is my argument.
at 07:18 on March 31st, 2009
That just proves that society is sick, not those that make a video changing the diapers of their child. Well, I for one would not load it on to youtube either though just send it to my Family.
at 07:39 on March 31st, 2009
I agree society is sick. (some of it anyway)
at 07:13 on May 18th, 2009
First off, I want to say that I watched the baby whipes advert. with an open mind. I honestly thought that the mother would maybe do a lil tap kiss on the babies butt check and, then there would be some paid voice describing how many vitamens&nutrients that will make your babies bum soft&clean. But really I don't like what I saw, there was a little too much butt kissing and she even squeezed the babies butt at one point. I don't think that was a good commercial at all.
See I believe that in a perfect world it would be ok to just be naked, because being naked wouldn't have to be considered as something sexual. But we're living in a world where everything is sexualized. There are still places were you can go, maybe in the middle of the jungle and find tribes that don't wear clothes at all because they just don't see thier bodies in that way. But if you take a look at america and they're people trying to make it illegal to breast feed because it "offends" soo many of them. A women's breast are created for breast feeding, but in our society breast are seen as sexual.
And please don't get me started on child predators. All I know, is that they're just too many child predators in the whole world, and to me, in order to protect our children we must keep them clothed when around people or in public places, or if their going to be taped and broadcasted on t.v.. Just because you or your family or whoever, dosn't see anything wrong with it because you don't think that way. Dosn't mean that there aren't thousands of other dangerous people out there that do think that way. Let me give you one example before I finish. You might consider changing your babies diaper in front of family or a trusted friend, but you wouldn't change your diaper in front of someone who sexually offends children. Just the same, you wouldn't tape an advertisment of a mother squeezing & kissing her naked babies butt, and then broadcast it so that any normal person or pervert child offender can see it.
at 07:07 on March 31st, 2009
itslefty,
That says more about the society in which you live rather then the subject matter. You may have a point about the police but then again the society is headed into troubled waters and it doesn't appear to be getting any clearer. A society filled with so much oversight by government and so much political correctness that there is little opportunity for free expression without every group right and left calling for someones head on a platter.
I am beginning to appreciate the play, "stop the world I want to get off". The best remedy is LOW profile, tread lightly leaving no perceived footprints in the sands of time. Not easy for an activist.
at 07:14 on March 31st, 2009
This is crazy A mother cleaning a babies bottom is in no way offensive or dangerous its mother nature. I watched my son clean his wee babies bottom and change nappies I can say I found it funny most certainly not offensive in any way. There is also a thing called Father love. This is going from the sublime to the rediculous.
at 07:15 on March 31st, 2009
I think you raise an interesting point but it is important to remember context as well. The context of a baby wipes ad and the context of a home made YouTube video are different. It's along the same lines of "the medium is the message."
I would be offended by a YouTube video like you describe be it a male or female kissing a bottom. In the context of a baby wipes commercial it makes sense.
That being said, my reaction is but a small part of the story. You are right to question the appropriateness of this sort of advertising. The act being performed on the child is the same regardless of it being an ad or a YouTube post and that should not be ignored. Like you said the baby is too young to have a socialized awareness of what has happened. When that baby grows up being in a baby commercial will not be traumatic but being in a YouTube video of the like could be devastating. Once the social context is understood by the now-grown baby the issue is a bit clearer.
Context matters. It can't be ignored. Which brings me to another point in your very intriguing question. We are socialized to accept lipstick lesbians as "sexy" and at the same time debating whether gay marriage should be legal. It is "cool" when pretty hollywood starlets share same-sex kisses and disturbing when our average looking next door neighbour is gay. The fact of a mother kissing a baby's bottom verses a father doing the same can be framed in this context. We are more comfortable with the suggestion of women in taboo sexual situations (even though this is not at all the intent here) than we are with men.
Thank you for this post, it really got my brain going first thing in the AM :)
at 08:17 on March 31st, 2009
Thanks Tina
The video's that I have used as examples are from "you tube". If I made a make believe advert a micky take of the "real thing" would I be left alone?
Would everybody say arghh and smooch back on their sofa?
at 07:52 on March 31st, 2009
I think the question is a very important one. On two fronts. One is the question of whether subtle sexual messages are being sent to sell the product, the other is whether we are demonizing adult-child affection too much. It's becoming so that not only family friends and associates like teachers, but now even close relatives are afraid to offer affection to children. We know without question that children need a lot of physical affection. To be handled and touched, just like dogs and puppies need to be jostled and played with, petted and hugged, bumped and rumpled. Yet the constant search for the sexual predator has tarred everyone, even mothers, to the degree that not one of us has the innocence to view a mother's touch as loving and gentle anymore.
I've known some adult survivors of child sexual abuse who did not feel the least bit abused. They weren't told that there was anything wrong with their experiences and the experiences did not cause them pain or fear. Nobody ever put any kind of negativity on it, and they grew up feeling fine about it. It brings up the question of whether children are sexual creatures or not, and what's making it abusive if there is sexuality in that context? There's no question of rape and molestation when the child is resistive or even when an elder is being seductive towards the child, but even so, perhaps we are becoming too vigilant.
I haven't even figured out the answers in my own mind, come to my own opinions, but I think the questions need to be discussed, and a lot. We're destroying childhood more thoroughly with our vigilance against child sexuality than we're protecting it. It's like being so protective of a lovely thing that we lock it in a hermetically sealed box and nobody ever sees it die. children aren't as innocent as we'd like to think, nor were we as innocent as we remember, but we're less innocent than we were, or perhaps should be.
I can't view a group of people in a park the same anymore. Every interaction between child and adult has taken on a sinister cast that ruins the joyful scene. I miss my innocence. How do we learn to fix this?
Perhaps the thrust should be one of teaching children to stand up for themselves by taking them seriously when they complain, yet then how do we spot the liars, of which there are and will always be plenty? Both adults and children use and abuse protection laws as weapons against others.
Again, every idea presents a more complex question. We must keep talking till we sort it out and pray that in the meantime we don't ruin too many childhoods in our efforts to protect.
Go kiss your favorite child and give it a pat on the bum and a huge hug, and to hell with the perverts who see too much in it!
at 08:08 on March 31st, 2009
Trust is a very important factor, In the name of terrorism and child abuse everybody is watching everybody else and while we are watching each other.
The scoundrals at the top are getting away with murder.
at 07:54 on March 31st, 2009
Sorry I only need to see the video. Nothing wrong with this mother doing this privately but even then most Mother's will not focus this much on one body part. This is ridiculous and over the top. The pedophiles already have downloaded this to be stimulated by folks. Just as Obama has to have a ridiculous amount of security we have had to dramatically change imagery, behavior and attitudes about our children's safety in all arena's. I hope people refuse to buy this brand to send them a message. I am not only an artist who enjoys drawing nude figures in the right place , privately. I appreciate the beauty of our design. Children and babies are even more adorable for they are totally alive in their skin and uninhibited. To see them running naked so naturally is a joy; now only for the backyard! I have known children destroyed by molestation as babies....it is disgusting. There is enough fodder out there for the sicko's without having on mainstream advertising.
This is certainly very sweet....sweet.. but their point can be made as well by kissing their belly. Why not be stroking other area's ? It is a beautiful time for parents and baby to be enjoyed privately .
at 08:02 on March 31st, 2009
i think this makes a good point. there are far too many liberties taken with human beings before they are able to make their own decisions. for example: i am atheist. yet i was baptized. there are plenty more examples, but this is a personal example.
i've come to learn that parents will do whatever they want and can get away with in the name of "parental choice." it doesn't always (or even often) have to do with what's best for the child. it's more often what's best for the parent's ego.
"Don't you dare tell me how to raise MY child!!"
the possessiveness of parents makes me sick. so many people have babies, but don't want children. so many people have children, but don't want them to be people. so many parents have done so much damage... and it rarely gets legally punished or even talked about because "it's MY child."
Yeah, just like how it's legal to KILL "YOUR dog" if you want to (as long as it's not done inhumanely, go figure).
i think this whole discussion is valid and needs more attention. all the claims of sexual abuse out there and ads like this get no challenge. all the attention on sex crimes and almost NOTHING on mental abuse crimes.
DISCUSS!
at 08:05 on March 31st, 2009
I couldn't have put it better myself.
at 08:56 on March 31st, 2009
Hello,
I grew up in Australia and had both my boys there. I'm sure that I'm not educating anyone when I say that summers there are HOT!
As a young mother (24) when I had my first baby, many photos were taken of my boys naked - playing at the beach, at home, at friend's places who had a pool .. you get the picture.
I was horrified when I first came to the States and realized that I could actually be arrested if I'd uploaded them anywhere. I suppose I could still be arrested just for having them in a photograph album that chronicles their lives.
I'm a mother for G-d's sake, I've kissed their cute little tushies numerous times, just as I've nuzzled their necks, or kissed them on the nose - all for the same reasons - I loved them to pieces - as a normal mother would.
Thank goodness Australia and other countries have not sexualized such things - young mothers would have missed out on so very much.
I bought a book while pregnant for the first time, it was on Traditional Indian Baby Massage. The bonding was amazing and I applied massage each time just before nap or bed time, or just prior to breastfeeding.
The process calms babies completely and you can see the tension disappear in their little muscles and faces, replaced by complete relaxation.
There was nothing sexual about it - nothing and I'd defy anyone to tell me otherwise.
Any 'powers that be' have probably never had children and cannot appreciate what it is like to bond completely with their own baby - without any sexual overtones.
The Johnson Baby Wipe ads are in the same league - there is nothing sexual there either. I'd love to know who comes up with these garbage comments.
As for the baby not having his/her own choice in the matter - my kids were always choosing to pull their own clothes off in summertime - they were just too hot.
~ Swan
at 15:20 on April 14th, 2009
I appreciate all of the comments, the feedback was great, thanks to all for reading and participating.
at 10:33 on April 15th, 2009
How about pictures on blogs or Youtube where many parents put up their own videos with their kids? Many parents show their naked kids and their genitals and I am curious about the opinion on that. The parents I socialize with and know pretty well would never do it, They think their kids have the same right to privacy as themselves but others say that children are innocent so why not show their genitals? Does anyone have an opinion on that?
at 12:06 on April 15th, 2009
That is a whole new topic, I believe a very good topic.
Why don't you start a new "opinion piece" on now public, I'm sure many people would have something to say on the matter.
at 18:49 on June 8th, 2009
I personaly feel that we as a society forcing children to be asexual beings is both cruel and damaging.
I was sexually active at age 8. and i always felt I had to hide what I was doing, out of fear of being beaten by an already abusive step father.
And i have been really lonely as an adult due to the repression of my sexual youth.
at 00:12 on July 11th, 2009
about child,that is very naive.