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Biggest fight of the 21st Century just started
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by YankeeJim | July 6, 2010 at 11:36 am
328 views | 2 Recommendations | 23 comments
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Civil War of 2010
This is an enormous political gamble unless you think you may have already lost in November.
Nothing gets Americans' dander up like messing with States’ rights. This is especially true when the Federal Government, as it says, has jurisdiction but then failed to do their job.
Federal law trumps state laws as the Preemption clause says in the Constitution, but what if the Federal Statue is full of holes or is unenforced, leaving states with demonstrated material damage. Can the state recover damages through their own suit against the Feds for the cost of illegal immigration?
The theoretical argument that the Arizona law will lead to discrimination is an intellectual one, characteristic of Eric Holder’s thinking. My guess is that will hold as much water as a bucket with a hole in it left in the parched Arizona sun.
Now, don’t get me wrong. I am in favor of legal immigration, but it must be within our capacity to manage in accordance with the law. Illegal immigration is a wound that has been allowed to fester to the point of threatening the health of the Nation.
Fixing the wound with proper Federal Legislation is the answer. Poking it with a law suit against the states will surely backfire. This is a sloppy and regrettable action.
“Justice Dept. sues, seeks injunction on Ariz. immigration law
By Jerry Markon
Washington Post Staff Writer
Tuesday, July 6, 2010; 2:39 PMThe Justice Department filed suit Tuesday against Arizona on grounds that the state's new immigration law illegally intrudes on federal prerogatives and is seeking a preliminary injunction to stop the legislation from taking effect.
The lawsuit invokes as its main argument the legal doctrine of "preemption," which is based on the Constitution's supremacy clause and says that federal law trumps state statutes. Justice Department officials believe that enforcing immigration laws is a federal responsibility, law enforcement sources said.
But the filing also contained a civil rights component as well, arguing that the Arizona law would lead to police harassment of U.S. citizens and foreigners. President Obama has warned that the law could violate citizens' civil rights, and Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. has expressed concern that it could drive a wedge between police and immigrant communities.”
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YankeeJim
Arlington, Virginia, United States
Most RecentMost Recommended Comments (23)
at 11:40 on July 6th, 2010
Here is DOJ's Complaint or Suit to the Arizona's Senate Bill 1070
at 12:08 on July 6th, 2010
Excellent -- I hope everyone reads it.
"Although states may exercise their police power in a manner that has an incidental or indirect effect on aliens, a state may not establish its own immigration policy or enforce state laws in a manner that interferes with the federal immigration laws. The Constitution and the federal immigration laws do not permit the development of a patchwork of state and local immigration policies throughout the country."
We are a nation of patchwork laws and regulations. Health care has been a patchwork. Law enforcement, fire protection, you name is a patchwork.
When the federal laws is deficient, patchwork fills the holes. This is really about the state of the nation and whether our solutions will be centralized or dispersed.
at 11:43 on July 6th, 2010
This is do something versus do nothing, IMO.
at 12:03 on July 6th, 2010
?IMO? It is like leaving the door or fence open and expecting everything to remain the same when you attempt to close it! There is no right or no wrong - only "human" lives at stake, although at who and what price remain for the future to only tell.
at 12:12 on July 6th, 2010
Oh, this is a very human situation. 12 million people entered the country illegally because we did not have the processing mechanism and capacity to manage properly. Time was not on our side and Congress and multiple Presidents let it languish. Now, we have a big problem.
In my opinion, due to no fault of the immigrants whom we apparently needed, they are here and should be processed in on fast track.
The gate must be closed and that means ratcheting up enforcement. It means increasing the capacity to do so. It means effectively eliminating illegal immigration.
So compromise for the lucky who are here, and hammer down on illegals from a point forward.
at 12:27 on July 6th, 2010
Making this a race war with Latinos to pick up votes very well could be what this will become. I bet both parties will agree to accepting those who are here already, and that Federal Legislation and more effective government is the long term solution.
The only winners, immigrants.
at 12:38 on July 6th, 2010
Here is the propaganda via townhall.com and now on this very site as just an ad. Who is right who is wrong? - if both side tell the the truth and leave it open for individuals to decide then and only then - it will no longer be propaganda.
at 13:36 on July 6th, 2010
I am awaiting an email from the President, his wife, his mother in law, madam Albreight, Joe Biden, David Plouffe, and all of the Congressmen to tell me how I should vote and to ask me for $25.
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PisdoffAmerican (not verified)at 16:28 on July 6th, 2010
Illegal Imigration , Entitlements, & Liberals are what will Kill this great nation. What has made this country great for many years has been taken advantage of and hijacked by left wing wackos!!! Their head honcho is the President of this disaster in progress. WE THE INTELLIGENT PEOPLE must act swiftly to stop this madness or we will continue to be enslaved to pay for these idiots FOREVER!
at 02:14 on July 7th, 2010
Actually, the left and right wing wackos help us define the middle.
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anymoose (not verified)at 17:22 on July 6th, 2010
www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/hispanicleaders.aspamericans get out.
at 20:38 on July 6th, 2010
Proof that not everyone living in the U.S. is an American nationalist.
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anymoose (not verified)at 17:24 on July 6th, 2010
should say .asp space americans get out
at 02:20 on July 7th, 2010
anymoose and others:
How many immigrants were planned to be added to the US population in the past 10 years?
How many illegal immigrants do we have? (Roughly 12 million)
What is the difference between these two numbers?
How much would it take to defend the borders and for the immigration service to process "x-planned" number of legal immigrants?
How much is budgeted for?
I don't know all of the answers but the answers exist. Making them transparent would be what Obama promised, transparency.
at 07:25 on July 7th, 2010
As one of the others, I would like to say that I agree with you. However, you suggest that immigration or atleast illegal immigration is a political issue to be resolved. I don't believe it is a matter of politics on behalf of the American pro-illegal immigration stance. If I can use that term.. Part of the ~13,000 lobbyist who spend huge money swaying government do not want an end to cheap labour. The Mexican or Latino spokespeople want it to be a matter of racial exception, and the right and left are left to debate along that line but, forget their history and the treatment of the Irish immigration, the Chinese immigration, the Russian immigration etc., etc.. And those people came through Ellis Island legally. This border issue did not begin with the former Bush administration. It has been a creeping relaxation of enforcement especially related to the textile and farming industry and has now been picked up by the construction industry and others with unionized workers. So... If this is to be resolved politically it will require a politician who is not afraid to loose favour with the electorate to enforce the laws of the land and future politicians to carry on in spite of the dollars placed in their path to do nothing. Ultimately, not a political issue but one of personal integrity and "doing what is right" in the face of organized opposition. Poor Sheriff Arpaio stands alone being vilified as a racist bastard in his struggle to do what is right and he is at the bottom of the chain of authority with very limited tools at his disposal.
I hope this makes some sense.
at 11:02 on July 7th, 2010
You make perfectly good sense here. Immigration policy is a matter of economic and competitive interest. Business will snatch cheap labor as well as an occasional genius that happen by the gate, or around the gate.
at 10:52 on July 7th, 2010
I don't believe it is a matter of politics on behalf of the American pro-illegal immigration stance. If I can use that term. You can use it. I'd just like to know what it means. The issue of immigration is a socio/economic issue that cannot be reconciled without a political solution.
There are extreme political viewpoints emanating from both sides of the argument. If one thinks that rounding up 11 million illegals is a viable solution to the problem, that is an extreme, unworkable political solution.. If one thinks that granting unconditional citizenship to illegals is the answer, that too is an unworkable political solution.
Saying that people forget the past treatment of Irish, Chinese, Russian and a whole host of others is speculative at best. Ask any American whose grandparents immigrated to the US if they don't remember how their grandparents, and parents were treated and you'll get an idea of how indelible a mark the abuse left on one's consciousness. Immigrants have always been treated unfairly by those already here. It doesn't matter if one immigrated legally or otherwise. Fear is a common denominator in how we treat people that we perceive as "different" or "threatening" our own level of comfort.
at 11:28 on July 7th, 2010
All true. If you take off the rosy glasses that we Americans like to wear as we were brainwashed to do from start, pioneers were brutal to native Americans and that persisted throughout history. I can't think of an ethnic group coming into the country that did not experience a period of abuse for the reason that you said.
In general, classes of people that are closest together in the hierarchy of civilization are competitive and in conflict, fighting and jockeying for the next rung. This is true at the intersection of every class.
In America today, we see the disappearance of the middle class. Where did it go? Mostly, it went to the bottom. As we see in recent history, wealth has become concentrated at the very top and into the hands of a few.
That circumstance happened because we allowed the creation of financial-paper based money making versus producing tangible products. As JoshArizona said, we are a consuming society that produces nothing and we are backed by the Federal Reserve that keeps printing more worthless paper. The jig is up.
So, Americans are closer to the bottom than they want to realize. They are fighting with immigrants who are willing to work for less, while it hasn't sunk into the displaced middle class that they must work for less or they will be without jobs.
at 14:27 on July 7th, 2010
To suggest this a matter of politics is near sighted. It is a matter of law enforcement. The immigration laws are not being enforced. Have not been enforced. Enforce the law. Exception can be made for those employed, green card them and monitor them, and further exception can be made for those who have American born children, short cut citizenship for them. BUT.. the rest need to go back to the gate and comply with the law. providing anyone ever shows up with the guts to enforce the law.
Now if you have issues with the law. Take that up with your politician. Changing the law ia a mater of politics. Law enforcement is not. Or at least should not be. That would compound the wrong.
at 04:25 on July 7th, 2010
You've touched a raw nerve with this one Jim. A bi-partisan approach to solving this issue is a non-starter. Former President Bush couldn't get his own party to support reform as a result of right wing reactionaries within the party. If you think Obama is going to get any help from the opposition, just look at the recent health care and "financial reform" legislation. The Republican's are being driven further to the right by a vocal minority and Obama has lost the support of his liberal/progressive base. There won't be any reform measures on immigration before the mid-term election.
at 04:51 on July 7th, 2010
Most astute. It isn't about reform, it is about getting on the record for the "Latino community," to get their votes. Obama isn't so much about results as he is about appearances and the illusion of results.
Polarization helps define the middle. In the end, can Republicans and Democrats afford to alienate a large voter block whose family members and immigrant applicants and wantobes are waiting in the wings?
They will find a way to let them in, and that's fine by me as that's how we all arrived.
The larger questions remain. What's it all about, Alfie?
at 05:28 on July 7th, 2010
It may well be true that Obama is playing to the fastest growing minority in the county. By the same token, the Republicans seem to be saying they don't want them, or need them. In the short term, (mid term election) the Republicans may be proved right. In the long run, it's a losing strategy. It's kind of like winning the battle and losing the war.
at 05:42 on July 7th, 2010
I think that Obama's transparent lust to "just win baby" is wearing thin.