Events Come Full Circle: Possible Avoidance of Accountability

by Karen Hatter | May 10, 2009 at 10:05 am

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George W. Bush, former two term 43rd President of the United States of America has been quoted as saying, in reference to his successor, the 44th President of the United States, Barack Obama:

“I want the President to succeed,” also saying,“I love my country a lot more than I love politics … I’m not going to spend my time criticizing him... and"He deserves my silence."

Former President Bush's outlook has not been shared by former Vice President Richard 'Dick' Cheney, who has used every opportunity at his disposal, since he has left office, to offer his criticism and to heap predictions of doom and gloom upon the head of the Obama administration.

As the former vice president's critiques have played as a soundtrack, providing background noise and two part harmony for others defending the Bush administration, as they pick up the notes of Mr. Cheney's lament, former Secretary of State Dr. Condoleezza Rice has now joined the chorus of those voices, having previously stated she agreed with former President Bush, that being that President Obama was owed her silence as well.

Of late, former Secretary of State Rice has offered her understanding and justification for the torture authorized by the Bush administration, which was eerily similar to the late President Richard M. Nixon's declaration that if the President does it, it isn't illegal.

After that statement, Dr. Rice attempted to clarify her remarks, saying that the President, meaning George W. Bush, would not do anything against the law, laying all that has transpired squarely on the shoulders of the former president.

Dr. Rice's statement indicates, according to Dr. Rice, President Bush's concern for committing illegal acts. It is unknown if further revelation will provide the possible direct link to his involvement in the authorization of the torture techniques, renamed “enhanced interrogation techniques”, during his administration.

Despite the fact that all of the elements and facts surrounding the torture memos and acts committed using the memos as guidelines have not been fully disclosed, what has been made known reveals the Bush administration sought the aid of the Justice Department to craft memos justifying “enhanced interrogation techniques”, acts that were carried out in the name of the citizens of the United States.

As an 'unofficial' strategy, in an effort to influence public opinion, the world has been subjected to non stop commentary, proffered by Vice President Cheney, explaining how the techniques used weren't torture and his belief that the techniques used were successful, a statement disputed and voiced by several from within the intelligence community.

Dr. Rice's latest contribution to the strategy may be a hazy gaze at preparation for a convoluted verbal defense which attempts to take the entire discussion of torture full circle and beyond the realm of any prosecutions being conducted by the United States.

Although any decision of that nature is the purview of the Department of Justice (DOJ), it has been the stated opinion by the current Obama administration that all personnel shown to be following guidelines issued by the Bush administration's Justice Department, should not be prosecuted, including Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) operatives.

That has always left open the door to the possible prosecution of those responsible for the redefining rationale and authorization of torture.

As Ms. Rice has been linked to the process of authorization, or has been characterized, merely passing it on, her latest, somewhat unexpected, declaration now embraces former President Bush and his involvement on some level and therein lies the completion of the circle.

As the former president is ultimately in charge of all who were involved in the decisions made as to how and when to torture, as alluded to by a former member of his inner circle, the National Security Council (NSC), all roads lead to the former president.

It can and may be offered that the former president relied on the advice of his advisors and the Justice Department, on his watch, for his information regarding the subject of torture, with the Justice Department being responsible for writing correspondence between the department and the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) on the subject of torture.

As the former president is described, by former Secretary of State Rice, as wanting to assure no laws were broken, when, not if but when, the determination is made that laws, federal and international, were broken, for the United States' part, it is almost a given reality that no sitting United States president will call for the prosecution of a former U.S. President.

After the completion of an investigation, began by the Bush administration, which began investigating itself, it has been suggested that maybe the attorneys that worked on the torture memos should be reviewed for the possibility of being disbarred, the only reference for any action to be taken regarding the torture memos that authorized the use of torture, renaming it “enhanced interrogation techniques”.

The current Department of Justice (DOJ), headed by Eric Holder, has the authority to write its own opinion, if assessments and evaluations of the documentation, included in the report, are contrary to the conclusions reached by the soon to be released report, possibly launching another investigation, with the chances of the latter eventuality occurring seemingly a long shot.

It may be international law that will be called upon to address the issues of criminality that arise as all of the activities that occurred become known, activities that were perpetrated and rationalized in the name of the people of United States of America.

Also at NowPublic:

Where Does the United States Go from Here?

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Yuliya Talmazan

at 11:12 on May 10th, 2009

It is quite incredible that the attorneys who worked on the torture memos are potentially to be the only ones punished for the work they were commissioned to do by top administration on torture cases. Since when does the mediator get more punishment than the perpetrator? Where is the logic in that?

albertacowpoke

at 12:04 on May 10th, 2009

This is what we have come to, punishing those that are hired to provide advise. Why would anyone even consider providing advise in the future? This is nothing but partisan politics at its worst, Especially when you consider that congress was briefed as early as 2002 and these methods.

http://my.nowpublic.com/world/nancy-pelosi-torture

http://bobmccarty.com/2009/05/02/letter-reveals-how-to-politely-decline-being-used/

Roy C

at 12:29 on May 10th, 2009

Members of Congress held no power to speak out or prevent the actions taken.

Just how would it be true that Nancy Pelosi couldn't have registered her strong objection directly with the CIA and Bush, let alone "leak" it to the NYT that illegal acts were being committed?

In fact, using the logic of a criminal conspiracy, the RICOH acts, and her co-responsibility as a high functionary of the US government, she would have a legal obligation to inform and object to any criminal act being furthered in the name of and with the use of American taxpayer money.

It is not true that lawyers rendering opinions must always have the "right" opinion or be guilty of a criminal act.

Only if the lawyers enter into a conspiracy to further the crime would they be guilty of anything other than incompetence.

duo

at 12:36 on May 10th, 2009

In 2008, Cheney and Gonzales were indicted by a Texas grand jury for being prison profiteers - profiting by withholding USDOJ investigations regarding prison torture within USA correctional facilities - American citizens - taxpayers and family members of taxpayers - were killed and abused inside prisons and jails with no questions asked. In fact, no questions were allowed (See YouTube Cochran Firm Fraud 1 and 2). Cheney's and Gonzales' cases never went to trial in Texas, but they need to be on trial somewhere.

It is no wonder Larry Neal's death was denied investigation and accountability by the USDOJ (http://wrongfuldeathoflarryneal.com). Many of the people who participated in torturing detainees in the offshore War on Terror camps are still in place in the USDOJ, the federal agancy that is paid from our tax dollars to protect the rights of institutionalized persons - incarcerated people and those in mental institutions.

I am not surprised if Bush and Rice chose to just hush. They need to. That's what you call "taking the 5th." It was reported last month that dozens of detainees who were held by the CIA are MISSING from the War on Terror camps. http://www.care2.com/news/member/513396753/1138715 I bet they are dead like my brother, who supposedly went "missing," but he was actually imprisoned in Shelby County Jail in Memphis until police killed him by depravation of heart meds or worse. The USDOJ under Bush allowed that jail to enter perjury in federal proceedings to gain release from federal overview - lying reports that no inmates died in custody although we had communicated with the USDOJ about Larry extensively.

If America's justice system wants respect, it needs to start treating people equally. No special privaleges for the higher-ups! Criminals need to be in jail, instead of mentally ill folks who are imprisoned to make money for private prison investors. SEND THE CRIMINALS TO TAKE THEIR PLACES.

albertacowpoke

at 12:28 on May 10th, 2009

The Democrats were in charge of Congress as early as 2007. They could have passed a law to make enhanced interrogation techniques illegal. It might have been vetoed by the President. The fact is, it didn't become an issue until the new administration was in power. I think it's time we see all the evidence in regards to this issue, not just bits and pieces to suit the partisan point of view.

In any case your comment sounds like the excuse used and reputed in the Nuremberg trials, "We were just following orders".

albertacowpoke

at 13:37 on May 10th, 2009

The water comment made me smile. thanks.

Roy C

at 12:32 on May 10th, 2009

Nancy Pelosi is guilty of malfeasance and misfeasance of office for allowing the torture to go on in violation of the Geneva Accords, a lawful treaty that is very much in play now, if you think that the acts were in violation of the accord.

This investigation will go nowhere as Nancy Pelosi's re-election becomes an issue, or else someone more to the liking of the SF Bay Area left will challenge her in the primary.

Karen Hatter

at 12:34 on May 10th, 2009

The Government Secrecy Act of 1997

Roy C

at 12:44 on May 10th, 2009

No Secrecy Act cannot superimpose itself on the signed Geneva Convention. She could have objected on record SECRETLY during the hearing, but she voiced no objection, as a matter of record.

That is not an excuse. That is willful neglect of duty, and possible obstruction of justice. And she could have raised the objection to Bush directly in private conversation of had someone sue the government in her name.

No guts, no integrity.

Amy Judd

at 13:39 on May 10th, 2009

Seems like everyone is scrambling to cover their own trail now.. interesting piece Karen!

albertacowpoke

at 14:08 on May 10th, 2009

They opened a pandora's box that won't close.

djermano

at 16:09 on May 10th, 2009

Very good Karen....But I would like to add that War is torture as well. It is without a doubt the guilt of Bush Cheney, Rumsfeld, and Powell, and Rice in waging this fake war on terror.

It has been 9 years coming since 911 happened...and still we have no conclusive evidence that binLadin or Taliban were responsible for doing it. In fact we have more evidence that 911 was an inside job... How is it that any responsible or reasonable person who is the President and his advisors could make a decision to go to war, that would kill thousands of innocent people...without knowing who was responsible for 911?

Even Bush later said Saddam was not responsible for 911......and incited lies about WMD they never found. How is it, this is not enough evidence to put these people in jail? Never mind the torture CIA files, and memo's. To me that is just more icying on the cake to their guilt, crimes and lies.

Their recklessness, in stopping investigations, and giving us a phoney 911 Commission Report...clearly is more evidence against these people....in covering up 911..because they created the diabolical plan. They refuse to answer many questions, refuse to release video tapes, and engineered this economic bank collapse crisis to imply that due to the crisis....there is no money to pursue them for the crimes they committed.

No one see's this?

The President and VP should be put on trial, along with Colin Powell, Rumsfeld and Rice...for inciting false claims, that ultimately resulted in over a million people killed by their judgement.

And the same is continuing with the Obama administration...with his protracted war bid and murder into Afghanistan and Pakistan. Obama now has blood on his hands...for following the same illogical reason we have this war. A war created because of 911....an event we still have no real answer's to who committed that crime..... And yet people are still being killed today because of it.

This is the height of corruption, illegality...downright disgusting misuse of leadership and political power. Obama is as guilty...... now.

http://my.nowpublic.com/world/taliban-are-gods-great-people-voiceforpeace...

Rev. Jermano

Karen Hatter

at 16:52 on May 10th, 2009

The point being missed in all of this is if members of Congress are to be held accountable for not voicing opposition to unlawful acts that violated international and U.S. federal laws, which were enacted and authorized by the Bush administration and the Republican controlled Congress, all those responsible, if it be, the President, the Vice President, members of the NSA, all responsible for ordering the creation of the torture memos by the Justice Department, using the torture memos to give the appearance of legality to illegal acts, should be subject to the full punishment of all applicable laws, international and federal.

albertacowpoke

at 17:03 on May 10th, 2009

If that's the case, let's get an independent truth commission going and make sure that all the material is examined. Expose a list of who knew what and when. This will include both sides of the isle, not just Republicans. This story has been tossed around in one way or another for more than four weeks. Let's make sure all the facts are tabled. America will never unite as long as this partison bickering is going on.

albertacowpoke

at 17:32 on May 10th, 2009

What you are saying may or may not be true. At this point saying that attorneys in question were being used by the Bush administration is only an allegation which has not been proven. That's why I feel if this is to be put to rest, a full inquiry of all the facts needs to take place. Then let the chips fall where they may. The lid is off the box.

Karen Hatter

at 11:41 on June 14th, 2009

Possible criminal conspiracy is at the heart of the torture memos as the Bush Department of Justice, using the Offfice of Legal Council and its attorneys, crafted plans to redefine torture to accommodate activities desired for use by the Bush administration, included among the activities waterboarding, referred to as simulated drowning, which can lead to physically collapsing the larynx, declaring waterboarding was not torture.

Reading the memos would indicate those writing them were attempting to craft strategy to avoid criminal culpability by dismantling the previous laws governing torture and rewriting and shaping new laws in the image of those seeking to engage in the activity of torture.

QueensHart

at 19:22 on May 10th, 2009

Rev Jermano! Respectfully we did not go over there only because of WMD..we fought the enemy in their territory. If your theory is true why would Obama be bombing with Drones and sending more troops to Afghanistan? The WMD were being pursued by IRAQ as actively as Iran and North Korea are frantically building nukes. Have you researched as much about what Saddam Husein did thousands of his people? That alone (!!) without WMD WARRANTED TAKING THE VILE , UNCONSCIOUS DICTATOR OUT. The media will not show the whole truth of the people who are grateful and all the good that has happened over there.

Why not look for the real truth? This torture as someone already posted once is a tempest in a teapot. ..it goes on and on and on................why not bomb the prison full of killers? No? we are going to let them have benefits and make it all better. We need more people who have testosterone to fight for us all. Feelers and wimps need not apply or we are going to all dissolve.

How many Jews could have been saved if we had technology to show what the Germans were doing? Oh yes, I can hear it now..we can't be sure those ovens are not scientific experiments ..Ah , Naaaw.the Germans could never get a way with doing that ...those people are being transported to another area for better homes! Of course that's so silly..what a ridiculous idea...killing familes...naw..no way !"

Why did we not WAIT(!?) for Saddam to get them and use them which he would have? That is a way out there....WAY OUT THERE ON A LIMB theory that 9/11 was an inside job. I can assure you if it had been FOLKS would have been'gnashing their teeth" ABOUT THAT instead of stirring and stirring and stirring this pot about waterboarding and torturing killers .

I wish they would waterboard that weasel Drew Peterson and find out where his wife is that he disposed of.

Respectfully Karen ,cowpoke has pointed out to you that the democrats were in control of congress in 2007.

Get an independent truth commission? Now how in the world could we do that ?They are all guilty. We need an entirely new congress and senate who can never serve more than four years. They spend money like I cannot believe!! Why are these crooks still there? Where are the committee's to investigate Barney and all. WE have to wait for an election to get rid of these: Murtha, Dodd, Reid, Pelosi who are more crooked and dishonest than Bush ever was. I think all of them definitely have multiple personalities. A person of multiple personalities is a person with several strong complexes . They honestly forget what they say...they deny saying and at that moment in that personality believe their own bullcrap. Perhaps persona might be better to understand.

Maybe we could require the congressman and senators to take truth serum to find out who is lying and who has taken hush money..nope that would be torture.

would it not? 90% of them would go to prison .

Rhonda J Mangus

at 18:30 on May 10th, 2009

Thanks for this story, Karen. If the present administration fails to investigate and hold accountable those from the Bush era, at least Spain will. It has launched a criminal investigation into US torture at Gitmo.

Tomitheos

at 20:37 on May 10th, 2009

KH: your start with GW Bush's quote makes for a great opening to this story and he has truly come full circle and it kept me reading, its informative and well done, good work

djermano

at 03:49 on May 11th, 2009

You are right Queenshart we didn't just go over there because of WMD that were never found but also to secure the 2nd largest oil reserves in the world. Obama is bombing and killing innocent people in Afghanistan for the same reason....in getting the Oil pipeline through Afghanistan through Pakistan to American markets. No question about it....its about Oil. You state that Iraq and Iran and North Korea are building nukes.....and you are right because the very guys who took us to war....actually sold nuclear technology and were themselves supplying them those WMD. The US was a major supplier of arms sold to Iraq, Iran, and nuclear technology sold to N. Korea through Donald Rumsfeld. I know very well what Saddam is accused of.....and you and other US media sources like to say he killed his own people....when clearly Saddam did not consider them his people. Kurds are not Iraqis...they are Turks who encroached on Iraq land from a Turk Civil War that still goes on today. Not to mention the Shiite who Saddam is accused of killing are known to be Iranian. And America was heavily involved in selling Arms and promoting Iraq to carry on War against Iran.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shiite#Demographics

You mean the media does not show the million people that the US killed....more than the number of people Saddam ever killed.....more than the number that died during the Iraq Iran war....in which a half a million Iraqi and Iranian soldiers as well as civilians are believed to have died in the war with many more injured and wounded .

The real truth is the War is also considered torture....and hardly a tempest in a teapot...it really happened guy...and they are still killing...and occupying other peoples homelands. It is not about your sexual inuendo...and frankly that is the major problem QH... you see through your clouded deluded mind.....that killing must be done....and it takes people with balls to do it....and you sell that shit to make us believe we should honor your mistakes, your sickness, your inabilty to think clearly.... I will never believe that....especially when the very people you are trying to protect here are the guys who supplied the munitions...and enticed Saddam and others to fight your illicit delusion wars.

Here we go...bring on the saddistic reasoning to WWII... It's like saying you sold weapons to Hitler so he could do what he did to the Jews. The funny thing is, it is what happened in a similar fashion to what happened in Iraq...because there is proof and historical documentation that the US did sell Weapons and technology to Hitler in those days....Even the Bush family..Prescott Bush was trading and selling arms to the Nazi's and is why Rooselvelt shut down the UnionCorp Bank in which Prescott was a CEO at the time... In fact WWII was really a spring board catalyst from WWI....which was about the bankers...and we know who they are....in continuing their profit making from the Opium Trade.

No the question to ask is..why the US was selling them to him in the first place?...And the reason is because they probably had this 911 attacked planned long before....knowing very well the US encouraged him to wage war with Iran...

Did you know the Bush family owns Oil wells in Kuwait? No one knew that bit of information when Saddam ultimately decided to reclaim Kuwait that was heisted from his country in the later early century. As the US was selling him weapons and the war was wagin on with Iraq..his debts were climbing.. He wanted to raise the price to Oil to pay the debts...but the US and OPEC refused. They boxed him in...while still wanting him to continue on his war in Iran. Then Saddam finds out the US is selling arms to Iran....and figures out that he is being betrayed.....then finds that Kuwait is slant drilling and stealing Iraqi Reserve Oil... You know I find a lot of information that totally proves the US is the monster in all this....and you people proudly support it. You know why you support it.....because you all made money from it. You made a bundle of cash from supporting the Military and its expansionism...not to mention the Domestic Jobs that came your way......But then Enron crashed.....and people were beginning to piece things together....and we saw 911 catapulted into the American psyche.

You won't admit your guilt....because you are controlled by the money profiteers, the guys who shut down the banks for whatever reason...whether they don't trust the lies of the Bush people, or the Bush people shut down the Banks to prevent people in making money to go after them.

Obama thinks he has a War in Afghanistan....well he doesn't know it..but the new war is brewing right under his nose in his own backyard.....and people are not going to simply say oh.....lets support Obama and revive the economy....because doing so will start putting more money into the Military coffers again.

The War will be ousting Obama......getting a new third party President...ousting all the criminals in Congress and the Senate who allowed this to happen...and dismantling the Supreme Court....because we know they are all a bunch of paid off hacks to begin with...supporting this corrupt American Government....

Such a Joke the American Dream has become the American Nightmare.......with dufus politicians who will kill innocent people for the sport of money, fashion, and being in the chik lipstick on the lips of Obama the pig.

Rev. Jermano

Long Live the Taliban

Rob Walker

at 04:18 on May 11th, 2009

Long live the Taliban? The people who treat women as slaves, who beat, torture, rape and pillage? Use suicide bombing and IED's to wage a guerrilla war against not just military targets, but their own people?

There's a difference between disagreeing with the United State's reasons and position when it comes to their wars, and backing a group that espouses hatred and sub-human treatment of women and minority groups.

djermano

at 04:56 on May 11th, 2009

You are an example of the many brain dead Americans who have been brainwashed to believe this fake lying war Rob. You should try thinking on your own...and realize 911 was an inside job......so that means they are killing innocent people in Afghansitan for nothing but Oil...

Do I need to tell you how many rapes were commited in the US last year? Try over 90,000. How about the terror and pillage in the USA.... Forget 911? Forget the screwing over the mortgage housing crisis that is still going on? How about the bank bailout....I call that major pillaging...700 billlion... How about the Bernie Maddoff pillaging, the lies, the slavery of people with US debt. Do you really know what you are talking about? Hey there is quite a long list....That I don't have time to give you here...but if you want to continue to know I will get it for you in the future.....

And so what do people use to fight the big military monster...that has accused them of being terrorists when they are not? Beer tabs, and bottle caps? No it is you people who have lied; support the lie....and go on your merry way demeaning people you know nothing about. You are a barnacle, a sick people...

http://my.nowpublic.com/world/taliban-are-gods-great-people-voiceforpeace.....

See comment section:

http://my.nowpublic.com/world/pakistans-army-attacks-taliban...

Rev. Jermano

QueensHart

at 14:07 on May 11th, 2009

"Weapons cannot hurt the SELF and fire can never burn him. Untouched is he by drenching waters, untouched is he by parching winds. beyond the power of sword and fire, beyond the power of waters and winds., the Self is everlasting......................NEVER CHANGING............EVER ONE.

KNOW THAT HE IS, AND CEASE SORROW.

The Bhagavad Gita