Israel angered by talk of US sanctions

by Susan Marie Kovalinsky | January 10, 2010 at 12:44 pm
741 views | 33 Recommendations | 53 comments

Quote

Nabil Abu Rdaineh, a spokesman for Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, rejected the accusation that the Palestinians were to blame for a lack of progress toward a statehood deal. "Israel continues settlement building in violation of the road map," Abu Rdaineh said. Under pressure from Obama, Netanyahu imposed a limited, 10-month moratorium on November 25 on housing starts in West Bank settlements, saying he hoped this would help restart negotiations suspended for the past year. But he excluded East Jerusalem and nearby annexed areas of the West Bank, and Abbas has not budged from his demand for a complete settlement freeze before talks can resume. Asked about Mitchell's remarks, Israeli Finance Minister Yuval Steinitz called U.S. loan guarantees a "token of friendship" but said Israel had no plans to use those available for 2010 and 2011.
Reuters

Israel's ire stirred by suggestions of US Sanctions

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In Israel, ire has been stirred by recent suggestions of US sanctions, related to negative acts on the part of Israel,   according to a Reuter's article.  

The continued development of housing projects contrary to an agreement with the Palestinians is one such negative act , contrary to the peace process,  which has caused the US to consider financial sanctions.  

JERUSALEM (Reuters) – A U.S. peace envoy’s suggestion that Washington could penalize Israel financially to force it into making concessions to the Palestinians drew Israeli ire on Sunday.

“Under American law, the United States can withhold support on loan guarantees to Israel,” George Mitchell said on U.S. television on Wednesday after being asked about the kind of pressure that could be brought to bear on Israel.

Over the past two decades, Israel has received U.S. guarantees covering billions of dollars in loans, underwriting that has been instrumental in raising money overseas more cheaply.

Although such guarantees have slipped in importance and Mitchell made clear in the U.S. public television interview that no sanctions against Israel were being considered, the remarks added more discord to Israeli relations with President Barack Obama’s White House.

In a statement late on Saturday “in reaction to media inquiries after Mitchell’s interview,” Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s office blamed the Palestinians for a peacemaking impasse which the envoy, due back in the region later this month, has failed to break.

“Everyone knows that the Palestinian Authority refuses to renew peace talks, while Israel took significant steps to restart the process,” the statement said.

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12
Sputnic

America and the world should throw the book at Israel

2
YankeeJim

Establishing Israel as a religious state ran counter to US values from the beginning. It is something that will never be right, anymore than Iran being a religious state. The fact of life is that the world must deal with them. As you say, whem they get out of line, throw the book at them.

10
stejeb

The Israelis have reneged on every promise and treaty so far just about back to 1948 when they were illegally and arbitrarily given dominion over the lands of Palestine.

For them to say that the Palestinian people won't talk is like accusing a mute of silence. If Israel really wants peace in the region, then let Israel stop taking what doesn't belong to them, and give back what they have already taken, and take the walls down.

Take a look at how the Palestinians are forced to live today in the West Bank and Gaza, take a look at the amount of land Israel has snatched...one point is likely to be made, about the amount and extent of land promised by the British, which took in a pretty hefty chunk of the region, maybe Israel feels justified in taking what it can of land promised by people the land didn't belong to.

One thing is certain, if Israel are going to look for a solution, they are more likely to do it if their bankers pull the plug.


8
Sputnic

Good point stejeb. Since when does the world negotiate with thieves, other than to tell them to return the booty

2
Hugh Askew

If i'm not mistaken, Israel has repeatedly asked that the Arab nations - and the Palestinians - to honor UN Resolution 181.   How many years have they been seeking compliance?  HOW MANY???????

Anyone see that compliance happen?  Anyone see the Palestinians abiding by any treaties?

Anyone?

4
snuffysmith

Here we go again. The last time the Administration made such a threat, Clinton fired  the US Ambassador to Israel. I am not surprised to see Israel respond quickly and with derision on any threat. They know that Congress will never approve, and the Israeli Government is confident that the U.S. media and the majority of Americans will not approve of such a measure.

The White House must now respond to this from the Israeli Government. But that's not likely. US makes threats but doesn't follow through. 

6
Sputnic

And the last time Hugh posted such a comment it was respondede to with a list of 50 resolutions Israel has ignored, the majority of them 20 years or so older than resolution 181

1
Hugh Askew

So when are the Arab countries going to begin to abide by UN Resolution 181?

When?

And when will the Palestinians begin to abide by treaties?

When?

10
hidflect

What good are treaties when legal fictions are held up in the face of obvious realities whenever it's to the benefit of Israel? It's against the law for the US to provide aid to a country possessing nuclear weapons. This makes sense... any country that can afford a nuclear program doesn't need aid! Now it's common knowledge that Israel has over 120 nuclear weapons. Solution? Simply omit acknowledging this fact and so allow America to keep on supplying aid. This is blatantly illegal activity. If Iran has IAEA inspectors, why not Israel? Once again, they are "exceptional" to rules everyone else must follow.

1
Hugh Askew

That ignores the question.

3
Sputnic

The UN should enforce its resolutions in chronological order. The above is a remarkably similar answer to what you received last time you asked the same question !

1
Hugh Askew

That is because no one answers it.

3
stejeb

I haven't read every single line of the resolution Hugh, from what I have read though I do feel the two really pertinent questions you should ask are

1) Who exactly had the right, on behalf of the Palestinian people, to give their lands away to foreign settlers from Europe with no historic right to the land?

2) If Israel want the Palestinian people to abide by the resolution, why have they themselves gone against the whole thing, and are getting away with it?

And I will ask you, Which part of the resolution do you feel the Palestinians should adhere to?

1
Hugh Askew

You will have to ask the UN about "giving" the land away. Might need to check with the Hebrews to find out about a historic right to the land...they do have claims on it going back several thousand years.

As to your last question, recognizing Israel as a nation - and Israel's right to exist as a nation, would be a real good start. Think that is part of the resolution - a kinda important part of it.

4
Sputnic

The Bible says the descendants of Abraham have a right to the land, the Palestinians are descended from... Abraham !

1
Hugh Askew

Oh, that conveniently leaves out the legitimate children, but certainly, if you say so, by all means.

2
Sputnic

Sure ALL OF Abrahams children got married !

1
snuffysmith

'Bush Sold Arab States Arms in Violation of Deal With Israel'

0
Susan Marie Kovalinsky

They are both heirs of Abraham.  There needs to be a two state solution.  Certainly Israel has not lived up to the ideal that Abraham would have wanted, the religious state.  

1
Hugh Askew

If you want to use that as an argument, then you need to read what the Bible says about what land was given to his descendants. If that is the criteria, as Sput has alluded to, then the argument is done. Over. Finished. The Hebrews own the land they claim, the Ishmaelites can pack up and leave and go live in the desert over against Babylon.

2
Sputnic

The orthodox jews, who are far more likely to be descended from Abraham, are largely against the state of Israel, as the jewish messiah has not yet come ! Basing this argument now, as we are, on scripture ! Non orthodox jews = more European. Although you have to look at where 11th century orthodoxy began to be sure

1
Hugh Askew

I appreciate you conceding the argument, especially as you were the one to bring up the scriptural argument.

Again, thank you.

1
Sputnic

Perhaps you forgot how to read ! How did I concede ? Read it again

2
Sputnic

The orthodox jews, who are far more likely to be descended from Abraham [than non orthodox Jews], are largely against the state of Israel, as the jewish messiah has not yet come ! Basing this argument now, as we are, on scripture ! Non orthodox jews = more European. Although you have to look at where 11th century orthodoxy began to be sure

2
Susan Marie Kovalinsky

I think that the modern state of Israel,  with its secularism,  has very little to do with Abraham.  It is simply European Jews forming a Democratic state, and something has to be worked out with their neighbors.  It is not a holy war.  It is a modern,  secular one.  I am thinking of the Israel with its huge "Sex and the City"  billboards,  with its gay bars,  etc.  This is the one we see and know.  With the rabbis protesting it all the time.  They have as much resistance from the orthodox rabbis as they do from the Palestinians.  A British man wrote a book, wondering if the right to the state had not been forfeited.  Something is all afoul there.  They seem at cross purposes even with themselves.  They need to decide what they are , and what it all entails.  

1
Sputnic

They do have to decide, you are correct. Who were the Jewish people of the old testament/Torah actually at war with ? Pagans and idolators, do either of those words describe a Muslim ? We should all work for peace and build a world based on common values. And that includes thou shalt not steal. Israel is run as an extension of USA PLC

1
Susan Marie Kovalinsky

Yes, it is a psychological self-misunderstanding which has grown cruder with each step.  If Israel is based on the Old Testament principles,  then it is at war with itself,  because it has adopted all of the  secular post-modern values.  If it is based on post-modern liberal democratic values,  with all the sex and political correctness and gay pride and hi-technology and fast-food glitz capitalism  -  and we know it is in fact based on this  -  then it would seem that the Palestinians are "too Abraham"  for them.    No wonder the Palestinians are confused.  They have stuck with old classical values, and have been put in the dog house for it.  The orthodox rabbis have more in common with them, than with their secular post-modern Israeli family.  What an historical mess!  

2
Hugh Askew

SMK, as far as i know, Israel IS a secular state. I only used the history/Old Testament here, because Sput brought it up.

It would get a lot simpler in the Muddle East, were the Palestinians - and the other Arab, and Muslim, countries - would recognize Israel as a nation, AND abide by UN Resolution 181 - passed in November, 1947. See below for a very abridged portion.

The Security Council determine as a threat to the peace, breach of the peace or act of aggression, in accordance with Article 39 of the Charter, any attempt to alter by force the settlement envisaged by this resolution;

The Trusteeship Council be informed of the responsibilities envisaged for it in this plan;

Calls upon the inhabitants of Palestine to take such steps as may be necessary on their part to put this plan into effect;

Appeals to all Governments and all peoples to refrain from taking any action which might hamper or delay the carrying out of these recommendations

2
nanute

HA,

I agree with you, to a point. As has been noted before, the Palestinians, have never met an opportunity for peace that they couldn't find objection to. The right to existence issue is clearly a Biblical/familial issue. (The house of Abraham divided.)

With regard to Resolution 181, could it not be argued that the 1967 war was a violation of the resolution on Israel's part? (Regarding the border issue.)

1
Hugh Askew

No, no, nanute.

The house of Abraham was not, is not divided. Ishmael was an illegitimate child, son of Hagar. Isaac was the inheritor of the promise God made to Abraham - which included the land that then belonged to the pagan Caananites.

If you want to use the two sons of Abraham and the Biblical ruling, as the deciding factor, then the land of Israel simply belongs to Israel. The Arabs, and Palestinians have to stay on the east side of the Jordan (that isn't exact, but i don't feel like going into detail here - you wouldn't care anyway) - descendents of Ishmael get the land all the way to Babylon (Iraq).

It was for that reason that i thanked Sput for conceding the argument. He brought the religious aspect into the argument, so then if that is the deciding factor, then everyone needs to leave Israel alone, sit down, and shut up. 

There is no real certain connection between what the muslims claim about Ishmael and their religion. The "Ishmaelites" were for the most part absorbed into the surrounding cultures - including the Hebraic - by the time Israel was a settled nation under King David.

Prophecy concerning Ishmael that was given to his mother Hagar: "He shall be a wild man; His hand shall be against every man, And every man's hand against him." You can do what you will with that one!


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stejeb
First Flagged at 1:38 PM, Jan 10, 2010 by stejeb

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