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Update: Scientists trustworthy? Apocalypse soon? "God machine" draws protest
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by SOLARLIFE | September 6, 2008 at 11:36 am
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Update: Scientists trustworthy? Apocalypse soon? "God machine" draws protest
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Update science talk
Black hole scientists trustworthy ?
Who has confidence in this scientists working on this "Nuclear" style project. What education do they have to tell the truth good or bad. Why so less TV interviews on
this important event. Viruses escaped, Radioactivty blowing in the air, stem cells cloning animals, humans perhaps in secret. Billions of dollars in this project, to do what ? Nothing for nothing. We expect better information. Tomorrow I update for video live Internet adress for Sept 10 2008; starting 9:00 am GMT+2hours (summertime Europe)
Mini black holes eating up universe or evaporate ?
Scientists neglect critics, saying the Large Hadron Collider Switzerland, starting Sept 10,could create Earth-swallowing black holes, mini black holes eating up the earth. CERN says black holes just evaporate after experiment. No one ever saw a black hole evaporating.
CERN scientists Switzerland mountainhigh, colliding deep in earth, no TV dsicussion
CERN does not tell any method, like for Radiaoctivity a "Geiger instrument", how to measure, if mini black holes are present or disappeared to earth center magnetic field. Similar a Russian roulette science game. If you bake a cake you know he is here or his not here, because you eat the cake. To predict mini black holes evaporate is comfortable, but stupid. More higher is the possibility we send them to another Universe communicating somehow with it and coming changed back "so called evaporate process". More real is to speak about a quantum leap into black matter energy systems. Like stem cells experiments, scientists will not tell, what they did already, and what they have in mind. The tiny particles much smaller than atoms, are called popular " the particles of God" nothing behind this barrier than "God". How we want take the run Columbus discovered America, CERN discovers God. Up to now mankind did not act by Collider power to copy the "Big Bang" universe birthday in a 20 mls roundtrip in Switzerland. Byproducts of triggering the black matter world: We will for sure see soon in the military world, someone dreaming to suck a whole army in a black hole, 2050 fiction ?
European court, US court can they stop the "God machine"
After taking in the results of CERN's report, the European Court rejected Rossler's request last week for an emergency injunction that would have stopped the LHC (it will still hear his lawsuit). The U.S. suit is pending, but CERN spokesman James Gillies said that even if it is successful the experiment will go ahead without U.S. participation."The U.S. court has no jurisdiction over our equipment. It could pull American scientists out of the experiment, but the experiment in Switzerland will go on.
Escape planet, quantum leap through black hole, stargate outlet to black universe?
The flip side of fear is faith in the redemptive potential of science, there are equally irrational websites about CERN, for example, that predict the LHC will create wormholes to distant corners of the universe where humanity can escape to other inhabitable planets.
On Sept. 10, scientists at the European Organization for Nuclear Research (CERN) laboratory in Geneva, Switzerland, will switch on the Large Hadron Collider (LHC) — a $6 billion particle accelerator that will send beams of protons careening around a 17-mile underground ring, crash them into each other to re-create the immediate aftereffects of the Big Bang, and then monitor the debris in the hope of learning more about the origins and workings of the universe. Next week marks a low-power run of the circuit, and scientists hope to start smashing atoms at full power by the end of the month.
Critics of the LHC say the high-energy experiment might create a mini black hole that could expand to dangerous, Earth-eating proportions. On Aug. 26, Professor Otto Rossler, a German chemist at the Eberhard Karis University of Tubingen, filed a lawsuit against CERN with the European Court of Human Rights that argued, with no understatement, that such a scenario would violate the right to life of European citizens and pose a threat to the rule of law. Last March, two American environmentalists filed a lawsuit in Federal District Court in Honolulu seeking to force the U.S. government to withdraw its participation in the experiment. The lawsuits have in turn spawned several websites, chat rooms and petitions — and led to alarming headlines around the world (Britain's Sun newspaper on Sept. 1: "End of the World Due in 9 Days").
Should we be scared? No. In June, CERN published a safety report, reviewed by a group of external scientists, ruling out the possibility of dangerous black holes. It said that even if tiny black holes were to be formed at CERN — a big if — they would evaporate almost instantaneously due to Hawking Radiation, a phenomenon named for the British physicist Stephen Hawking, whose theories show that black holes not only swallow up the light, energy and matter around them, but also leak it all back out at an accelerating pace. According to Hawking, if tiny black holes occurred at CERN, they would evaporate before they got a chance to do any damage. (Even if Hawking's theories prove to be wrong — no one has yet witnessed black-hole evaporation — scientists at CERN say the LHC's collisions are already known to be harmless: an equivalent amount of energy is produced hundreds of thousands of times a day by cosmic rays colliding with the earth and other objects in the cosmos — always without incident.)
After taking in the results of CERN's report, the European Court rejected Rossler's request last week for an emergency injunction that would have stopped the LHC (it will still hear his lawsuit). The U.S. suit is pending, but CERN spokesman James Gillies said that even if it is successful the experiment will go ahead without U.S. participation.
"The U.S. court has no jurisdiction over our equipment. It could pull American scientists out of the experiment, but that would just be a great shame for them. The LHC presents no risk. What it does do is hold the promise of substantially enriching humanity by providing insight into the mysteries of the universe. It's a tremendously exciting time for physicists here and around the world," he said.
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Most RecentMost Recommended Comments (36)
at 13:39 on September 6th, 2008
SOLARLIFE, I like this story. It's good stuff.
at 13:48 on September 6th, 2008
Emilio thanks for Flag "Apocalypse soon? "God machine" draws protest", insiders say swiss cheese will have more holes, if experiment goes wrong.....
at 13:54 on September 6th, 2008
If it is the end of the world, I hope it is televised.
at 14:18 on September 6th, 2008
dunkelberg thanks for flag , good idea "If it is the end of the world, I hope it is televised." I call next week CERN, where to see on TV, if not why not. CNN linked over the headline to time article, they get interested, situation gets new drive.
at 14:24 on September 6th, 2008
SOLARLIFE, I like this story. It's good stuff.
at 14:56 on September 6th, 2008
Thanks Rhonda for Flag "God machine"
at 16:27 on September 6th, 2008
SOLARLIFE, I like this story. It's good stuff. I've read a very tiny bit about the new accelerator. If anything does go wrong, we probably won't know about it. How long did it take for the present universe to expand? 12 seconds?
at 17:07 on September 6th, 2008
Thanks Barbara McPherson for Flag "God machine", your comment "If anything does go wrong, we probably won't know about it. How long did it take for the present universe to expand? 12 seconds?" dazzling comment 12 sec, I must admit I never thought about it, if anybody knows pls write.
at 17:17 on September 6th, 2008
Solarlife...sounds like Applewhite stuff, you know the guy who got his followers to put on tennis shoes, kill themselves, in hopes of a space ship would save them. I believe colliders have been operating for decades, so why would this one create wormholes in the universe?
at 17:32 on September 6th, 2008
Dr.Marty, thanks for comment "colliders operating for years..." true, the swiss cern collider is operating for years. But with the new machine 20 mls roundtrip, first time in history the energy and speed of the particles is high enough, critical"mass" to collide creating a mini black hole. The term "wormholes in the universe" may be a popular explanation that the energy disappears in a sort of ray (wormhole) out of the black hole into another place creating there the wormhole, simply said "Stargate in, stargate out", possible ?
at 18:58 on September 6th, 2008
SOLARLIFE, I like this story. It's good stuff.
at 00:57 on September 7th, 2008
Thanks Paschen for Flag "God machine", any news from Japan ?
at 07:10 on September 7th, 2008
who gave them permission/funding to do this and why didn't they read the small print!!
at 11:45 on September 7th, 2008
Hi snadra,"Godmachine", ..."who gave permission/funding ?" About 20 countries funding the experiment. Who gave permission: NOBODY; may be they "received secret messages out of the collider to go on."
at 09:57 on September 7th, 2008
I'm very excited about this event not that I understand ANYTHING about particle physics but any new information about how the universe started is fascinating. Take a look at this to learn more about funding http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CERN
at 11:39 on September 7th, 2008
Thanks Mrsmission4, the CERN website on Wikipedia very helpfull, more than 20 countries funding this project "God machine". Amazing I found this chapter about earlier antimatter experiments: Anti-Hydrogen, Anti-Helium why ?
Preservation
Antimatter cannot be stored in a container made of ordinary matter because antimatter reacts with any matter it touches, annihilating itself and the container. Antimatter that is composed of charged particles can be contained by a combination of an electric field and a magnetic field in a device known as a Penning trap. This device cannot, however, contain antimatter that consists of uncharged particles, and atomic traps are used. In particular, such a trap may use the dipole moment (electrical or magnetic) of the trapped particles; at high vacuum, the matter or anti-matter particles can be trapped (suspended) and cooled with slightly off-resonant laser radiation (see, for, example, magneto-optical trap and Magnetic trap).
So Antimatter can be trapped by magnetic trap. CERN saying mini black holes can not be trapped by earth magnetic field ( for growing on eating up earth ) Does not fit together !
at 11:50 on September 8th, 2008
This is just dumb. What if this goes wrong and it creates enough blackholes to engulf the very planet you live on and possibly destroy it? Is there a fail safe as to if things went incredibly wrong and did the very thing you are trying to do?
at 11:59 on September 8th, 2008
>This is just dumb
Actually, if anything goes wrong the machine will simply shut down.
at 12:06 on September 8th, 2008
Maybe it can just shut down? But if the damage is already done. Who's to say they can just stop a huge gaping black? Not to mention if the black hole gets massive enough the possibility of it engulfing everything around you is inevitable.
at 12:18 on September 8th, 2008
>a huge gaping black (hole)
The biggest black hole they could possibly get from this machine would be the size of an atom and would evaporate in less than a second. The chance it would suck an atom into itself and grow larger is very small since it is in a near perfect vacuum environment and there are not many atoms in the vicinity, and then it would evaporate right away anyway. Black holes that size form all around us all the time and evaporate and we don't even notice. There might be things worth worrying about in the world, but this isn't one of them.
at 12:24 on September 8th, 2008
So its in a vacuum concealed room with not many atoms. But still there is atoms everywhere. Who's to say it wont just suck in everything around it in this near perfect environment? Or use some type of gravitational pull to suck in other things?
at 12:38 on September 8th, 2008
The scale is so small the event will not be detectable.
at 12:58 on September 8th, 2008
That's to easy Fairbanks, because something is small, (like a virus), still it can grow, trapped in the magnetic field of the earth; as you say will be not detectable at the beginning. The Quantum leap effect in the black matter world, nobody knows the rules, nobody ever investigated it. Very simple up to now no machine for test. The question stays why such an effort to know how we came in existance. The Military aspect was not brought up by cern; like always.
at 12:47 on September 8th, 2008
If it is so small then why is our us government trying to stop this from happening? You can think loigcally but so many things can go wrong and probably will. i know our government has no say in what goes on in other countries. But I am outraged that they can just make this and use it without knowing exactly what will happen or side effects.
at 12:57 on September 8th, 2008
Good point wtfwereyuothinking
at 13:02 on September 8th, 2008
Solarlife, Just curious is to how you feel about this. Are you for them doing it or against?
at 03:33 on September 11th, 2008
wtferwereyouthinkig, you ask If I am for or against. So my answer, is I do not like to see uncoordinated scientists going for adventure in black matter worlds. We need a new type a Science group manager and civil society watchdogs. Every new experiment comes with accidents one or the other day. The Risk management at CERN does not convince me, shutting down the Website? No youtube/TV reports to much "employee/money/nuclear lobby". The idea is like in 20th century when we found the electron beam to use for TV with magnets to move the beam in a Vaccum over the screen. Now we removed the screen, in reality expecting to beam ourself somehow by accident into other dimension and come back. The industrial part are beams for medical, beam weapons, Hydrogen fusion and the Unknown. It is comfortable to say the byproducts of the BigBang collission (not yet done only roundtrip testrun up to now) the mini-black holes admitted from Godfather BigBang Prof Peter Higgs "evaporate". I never saw energy evaporating, it transforms E=mc². How transforms negative matter, black holes? I think a negative quantumleap like Balman, Braket, Palmer energy jumping is to expect. I would postulate if you would combine two BigBang chambers, you jump stargate in the black hole changing frequencey pattern and jump out at the other stargate. The transfer mechanism we have to explore, will come in next 15 years, if we keep the discipline of responsable universe related decisions and at the same time watch alerted like Harisson Ford to repair before.... I would prefer to invest $50 bn to refill the Ozone layer with lasertriggered Satellites recombining the splitted Oxygen (still here) to O3 Ozone layer. My science choice to planet Terraforming, remake planet (geo climate engineering) for next generation rather than to escape in a black hole to other worlds. Finally the french have a nice word the situation is "Contradictoire" means both opinins have to collide in competition to progress. Like learning walking in the Universe...
at 02:36 on September 11th, 2008
so what is going to happen in the next few weeks? Should i give up my job, live in my local drinking my favourite tipple and just wait for the end? so much to do and maybe so little time! what changes will we notice, what warning will they give if it all goes pear-shaped?
at 03:39 on September 11th, 2008
barry bellis "What warning will they give us?" probably none, shutting down the internet website and having a bottle of Champaign. The BigBang Event, I will update to expect In earliest one week or 2 weeks. Have a beer meanwhile.
at 10:19 on September 11th, 2008
Well I guess we are still alive. Not sure how the launch of that weapon went. But we are still alive so i'm guess it pretty much failed. That or there doing some serious cover up work to hide the huge blackhole. Solarlife you make a valiant point with what you say. Instead of doing this dumb shit which probably wont work anytime soon. We should work on other things that seem a bit more possible. Such as fixing the ozone and trying to stop antartica from basically melting. I know thats not in the realm of possible but hey saving an endangered species which might die off in the next year would be an excellent acomplishment. Now you can crack open the CORONA!