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When people ask me why I'm a feminist...
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by generaldecay | October 30, 2009 at 01:14 am
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... here is one of the reasons I give.
Marlon King, who earned about £1 million a year, was sacked by his club, Wigan Athletic, after being found guilty of groping a 20-year-old woman and breaking her nose with a single punch. He was out drinking last December to celebrate his wife’s pregnancy, and a winning goal he had scored hours earlier....
Southwark Crown Court was told that on the night of the assault, King was “cold-shouldered” by a series of women in the Soho Revue Bar in London. He then approached his victim, a “slightly built” student. During the trial, the victim said: “I felt someone grab my left buttock. I turned round and was quite disgusted and shocked.”
She said King told her: “You’re not even in my league, love, I’m a multimillionaire.” Then, in a burst of “completely gratuitous violence” he hit her, “smashing” her to the floor.
The woman wept as she listed her injuries. “It split my lip, broke my nose and gave me a black eye. It felt like I was bleeding everywhere, but it was mainly my nose and mouth.”
This man approached several women in the bar, was rejected, then groped another, and when he was rejected again, lashed out in an extremely violent way. But not before 'reassuring' the victim that she wasn't good enough for him anyway. After groping her.
Because, as you know, sexual violence against women is a compliment; it's an indication that he would 'do her', and she should be grateful for the attention.
This behaviour is a clear demonstration of this man's sense of entitlement to have sex with any woman of his choosing, regardless of what she thinks. When he was rejected by said woman, he became violent. Because she turned him down and he did not believe that it was her right to do so. No does not mean no to this man; it means that she should be punched in the face for not fulfilling his sense of entitlement for full sexual access to women.
These attitudes are everywhere. If you go into any pub or club in the UK on a weekend night, you will see men who have exactly the same attitude and who expect that they should also have full sexual access to women.
And this is one of the reasons that I am a feminist.
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Most RecentMost Recommended Comments (25)
at 03:34 on October 30th, 2009
It is sad that this attitude prevails, however this should be covered by the law. What this man did is unacceptable and I would hope that this is not indicative of how all men think. I like to think those jerks are in the minority.
at 03:38 on October 30th, 2009
ACP, it is covered by law. This charming man is doing some prison time for it. But it all depends on offences of this nature being reported, and they are one of the least reported crimes.
I like to think those jerks are in the minority too, but I fear they're not.
Thanks for the recommendation and comment.
at 04:59 on October 30th, 2009
So, what do you have to be when the majority of children who are victims of lethal violence in the confines of the family are actually killed by their mothers?
Women are quite capable of violence and picking on humans smaller than themselves because they are "in a bad mood" as well. I seem to remember quite a bit of that in my own home as a kid, as a matter of fact. Funny about that, the perspective it gives.
In fact, the prisons are full of men whose mothers or fathers beat the living hell out of them as children.
There are no sex-based monopolies on virtue or vice.
And, that is why the women I really respect don't paint men as being fiends nor women as saints.
at 06:46 on October 30th, 2009
This isn't about women NOT committing violence - they do. Of course they do.
This is about a very specific prevalent attitude amongst some men that they have an entitlement to women's bodies and full sexual access to women. This sense of entitlement led to the sexual and physical assault described in the piece in the Times.
And I'm not sure where the 'being in a bad mood' comes from as no violence (from women or men) should be attributed to being in a 'bad mood'. That is diminishing and inaccurate.
at 07:39 on October 30th, 2009
Yes, but all violence needs to be dealt with, and the fact of the matter is that a good near 50% of spousal violence is women beating up men.
Your article, an opinion piece, is about how women get victimized. Good. What about the rest of the violence that goes on between women and men?
And, frankly, as a boy, I was at the receiving end of a lot of violence from a woman. So, I see it all differently. I see it as it should be seen.
Women are less often bullies than men because they are physically smaller than men. But when the "men" are smaller than they are, male children in particular, the women are the same.
I would like to know if that guy was ever the victim of female violence as a kid. Not an excuse, at all.
But, OJ Simpson was. Did his rage against his wife begin with a mother who used to beat him with a belt?
Most of the violent criminals had violent mothers.
at 07:48 on October 30th, 2009
I couldn't agree more Roy. Violence sickens me, no matter who is doing it or who is on the receiving end of it. And there is no denying that there is a lot of violence between men and women, perpetrated by both.
Indeed I did a research study some years ago in Ireland which looked at how male victims of domestic violence are treated by and in the criminal justice system. One word can sum that up: badly. It's a vastly under-reported crime because so many men have found that they are simply not believed when they report that they have been victims. They are very often even laughed at by the police etc. Disgusting. It's a situation that is improving, in both Ireland and the UK, but it still needs a lot of work.
So yes, this particular piece focused, as I said, on an attitude of entitlement towards women's bodies that led to violence, but I don't deny for a second that women are violent too.
I'm sorry that you experienced violence growing up. No child should have to live with that.
at 18:48 on October 30th, 2009
Recommended that, Roy.
at 06:15 on October 30th, 2009
I am very annoyed by this statement yes your find men like that in every country in the world in the worst bars and worst places that a cwomen on her own should never go. As a man there are places and bars that I do not go to.
Please do not point out Britian is the worst place for this type of offence as its not, most bars and clubs in Uk do not have these animals as they are banned.
Hey I am a male-ist stating very clearly do not tanish all men with the same brush!
at 06:25 on October 30th, 2009
Honestly, as a woman who goes to bars and clubs a lot in this country, I can definitively say that there are men like this in all of them. Is it all men? No. Is it the majority? In some pubs/ clubs, yes. Will there be at least one or two men like this in every pub and club? Like I say, as a woman who goes to pubs/ clubs a lot in this country, I can that, yes, there will be men like this in every single one.
The statement was not tarnishing all men with the same brush. It did not claim it was all men.
Note also that the statement did not claim that the men alluded to will be violent - rather that the men in question have a sense of entitlement regarding women's bodies. These men aren't banned from clubs. That doesn't get you banned. I'm not sure where the idea that it would comes from.
at 16:01 on October 30th, 2009
generaldecay: Bars and pubs are not exactly the best place to observe "the average man". Nearly every man that I know is appalled by the small minority of men who feel that they are God's Gift to Women. Real men treat women with the respect of equality; do not judge the rest of us by the actions of drunken macho-men in bars.
By the same token, this is why I advised my brother not to pick a third wife from a woman met in a bar; I would think that two irresponsible, gold-digging, philandering spouses would be sufficient to send him somewhere besides the club to look for a decent woman.
at 01:54 on October 31st, 2009
TiredDem, absolutely. Unfortunately, this is where many of these men choose to congregate and if a woman wants to go for a night out to a pub (as I do) she has to deal with them. Nowhere did I say that this is the 'average man', nowhere did I say that I judge other men by these men. My point was that these men very much exist.
As I also stated above, not ALL men that one encounters in bars believe in this sense of entitlement. By the same token, not all women in bars are irresponsible, gold-digging and philandering. But there are indeed enough of both.
at 07:39 on October 30th, 2009
I don't think generaldecay is tarnishing all men with the same brush at all here, but I can definitely see what she is saying about men like the one described here who feel almost a right to treat a woman like that and feel like they can get away with it. I've seen it myself - I'm a young woman who has been to bars and clubs in numerous countries around the world, there's always that one guy who thinks he's doing you a favour by hitting on you, and not so strangely he's always the biggest loser in the bar.
This guy described here is an extreme though, he clearly has some underlying issues that can't all be against women, something must be loose in his head somewhere....
at 07:57 on October 30th, 2009
Amy, thanks for the recommendation and comment. And OH YES who IS that guy at the bar who thinks that he can have his pick of women and will not think twice about getting nasty when he's turned now. I would very much like it if he stayed at home and stopped bothering us!
at 08:04 on October 30th, 2009
Let's see something on inter-generational violence, the way violence gets transmitted on.
at 08:09 on October 30th, 2009
Roy, I reiterate, I do not deny other violence. I also reiterate that this post is about a very specific attitude that some men have towards women by which they believe they have an entitlement to their bodies.
Indeed, this post wasn't even about the violence perpetrated, per se, or about violence between anyone/ everyone. It was about that attitude and that perceived entitlement that some men feel they have over women. So the fact that I haven't covered covering all aspects of violence is irrelevant, frankly. That wasn't ever the point of the post.
at 10:31 on October 30th, 2009
Well, thanks. The man is a narcissist for sure and an alcoholic for more-than-maybe. Yes, that attitude is awful.
I will explain why we men get a bit sensitive about such stories. I have been hearing them for 40 years. That is a long, long time to hear about what men do wrong with scant activity in the opposite direction.
If I had been there, the man would have had a real lesson. I can't stand men like that. They also abuse other men because of the narcissism, alcoholism and propensity for violence.
at 09:34 on October 30th, 2009
GD - you're not getting the memo, are you?
The truth is that heterosexuality is less than equal to homosexuality by resulting in monogamous (maybe) global overpopulation
Also that truth is absolute, even though it is predicated by a finite observations of empirical data sets and therefore could be contradicted at any time.
Also, truth is fact based unless it applies to religion.
And that women don't have a right to choose, unless a man says it okay first.
at 09:40 on October 30th, 2009
No one sent me the damn memo! Is that because I is woman and I is therefore not worthy of memo?!
at 09:59 on October 30th, 2009
No not because you are a woman, but because it said not to be shared with feminists. You must be on that list
at 10:26 on October 30th, 2009
I just want to remind some members here that baiting of other members is not allowed.
If you need a reminder, this is from our code of conduct:
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Joey Jameson (not verified)at 16:19 on October 30th, 2009
Isn't it interesting that a woman writes an article about some men's assumption of entitlement and superiority is she immediately attacked by men demanding that she talk about something else.To Roy C: You don't get to tell women to stop talking about violent, sexist men. We will talk (or post) about whatever we want to talk about. To demand that we only talk about your pet issue (violent mothers apparently) is an example of the problem (sexist men and their entitlement problem.)
at 17:32 on November 8th, 2009
I find it no more or less interesting than the men who are being attacked for trying to point out that it is definitely NOT the majority view of Men that women are not equal and should be treated as sex objects. Which is an example of the inverse problem; narrow-minded female sexists and their irrational hatred and hostility toward all men.
at 02:05 on October 31st, 2009
I don't normally respond to anonymous comments but that was exactly what occurred to me too all day yesterday as I was going back and forth on this thread.
Note that I had to explain a number of times that this post was not about whether or not women were violent but rather about a very specific sense of entitlement felt by some men about women's bodies. Even then, the point still had to come back to violent women. Though the post was not about that. It was about a very specific sense of entitlement felt by some men.
Yes, Joey Jameson - most interesting indeed. I also note here that this does not just happen on NP and this observation is not just about this thread. It happens all over the web. Women talk about an issue and a man comes in and tells them that they should be talking about an issue that is important to them (and therefore more important overall). Similarly, a person of colour makes a post about an issue, and a white person comes in and tells them to talk about something else that is relevant to them. This has happened to me numerous times before so yesterday honestly came as no surprise. Privilege is a complex problem.
at 03:56 on November 1st, 2009
I think perhaps everybody has been hurt by a narcissist at least once in their life, both male and female. Thats why stories such as these promote such emotional responses. THE man that did this is an ass, something made him that way, possibly his mother, or perhaps more likely the bizzar super man status bestowed on footballers and celebritys in general
at 15:06 on November 12th, 2009
When I was child, growing up in the '60s, these people were around, male chauvinists, abusive parents, wife beaters people who would jam a broken glass in the face of another over a stupid argument in a pub.......you could just go on and on. And I remember my thoughts that with growing technology and information, better education and communication- that all that stuff would one day be a thing of the past.
Well it still isn't, and I don't see any hope of it in the near future.
I find that man's actions as disgusting as any "feminist", but I don't see quite see how it is has any bearing on why one should have reason to be just a different tital of bigot.
Surely the only issues here were his violent, self-proclaimed superiority...a criminal act punished ( though leniently in my view) by the law, the failure of the bar to act immediately in bringing in the police, and lets not forget his football club's chairman's action in immediately sacking him for his behaviour....a male chairman by the way.