Where does the Afghan Mission go off the Rails?

I agree it would be great to have a clear cut missiom, but unfortunately we don't.......more brave souls will be lost in this seemingly never ending war.

Afghan situation has to be looked into within historical perspective.The mission was crystal clear-caspian oil.Taliban were allies at one point of time,their relevance was lost in no time as soon as Soviets left Afghanistan,Taliban game plan was put in place which was at total variance with the mission of US empire.That was begining of a conflict with armed intervention.The British empire couldn't subjugate Afghans,nor could Soviets.US intervention helped Alqaeda to enhance its base with more zelout recruits.

@Karl Goddhardt.Your analysis is based on certain assumptions,which in my opinion are pertinent provided things go the way US wants.But ground realities suggest otherwise.Iran-Iraq war was the first war which was lost by both at enormous cost in terms of human lives.US war against Afghans is unlikely to be different.

From this soldiers perspective the glaring flaw is the "Vietnam-ization" of the mission layout. By this I mean the concentrated effort around the urban centers. U.S. Administration is fighting as they did in Vietnam. They are concentrating their forces in urban areas rather than the rural countryside from which the Taliban and al-Qaeda operate. IMO,  NATO/U.S. Forces should leave the urban areas to full Afghan administration. Turn the bases built in these areas over to the Afghan Army and rebuild deeper into the countryside and effect command and control from there. Let the ANA and ANP worry about the hearts and minds of the population centers who already live a hundred times better than their rural brethren. Instead of making forays into the countryside like they do, aka Vietnam to hunt the insurgency, place bases with in the nexus of rural hamlets [like a wagon wheel] and give these areas the security and improved services they need to build more productive lives. In this way we would be defeating the militants influence to recruit as well as the rural peoples sense of disenfranchisement due to a lack of administration attention. Two birds one stone.

Thiryt ought Six I think we're on the same page, just expressing it in a different way.  We have to adapt to the culture and provide the security and not impose our values on them.  All they want is to live safely and put a meal on the table for their family.  Maslow Hierarchy of Needs.  Once you get the needs looked after you can work on the wants.  So simple lol.

I'm always a little concerned when I hear that we ought not to impose our values on them. Humans share the same values. We do not have different values than the Afghan. The Afghan value the same things we do. What is changing for the Afghan is the opportunity to actively support those same values to a similar degree of opportunity that we have. You mentioned Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs. These ontological and universal needs are the fundamental basis of our values which we all share. Given opportunity, and access to the basic requirements. Afghanistan is a Muslim country. An Islamic governed country. We are supporting that and their democracy with in the confines of Islam. WE are not changing them. THEY are changing as their circumstances improve and so allow a natural willingness to acceptance things not before experiences during the last 40 years of continuous war and bitter hardship. Of course things are changing. Especially the reliance on tribalism. That upsets a long standing social division and power structure. One heavily exploited by the Taliban and al-Qaeda to obstruct the National [inclusive] Government of Afghanistan. Let us not forget that it is the Taliban who is using a weaponized version of Islam against the people who they want to dominate and rule over as dictators of what is of value in the lives of Afghans. They are the ones who want to impose values on them.

My point is that we have to work within their tribal governance.  Maybe values was overstating it or we have different interpretations of it.  I agree the Taliban rule with fear, but until we are in a position or the Afghan Security Forces are in a position to ensure a safe environment for the local populace, this will continue.  

The onus is also on the Karzai government to quit playing games and reach out to the regional leaders and get them all pulling on the same rope. 

There is a natural distrust of foreigners and based on Afghanistan's history that's understandable. 

The question is how much patience do the American people and NATO members have to see this through to a successful conclusion?

"My point is that we have to work within their tribal governance." I think the primary goal of "National" governance is to rise above 'tribalism". Tribalism is exactly what the Taliban exploit to obstruct the national government and interfere with their democratic elections. I agree that the Karzai Government is often seen as playing games but, in their defense they do have a fine line to walk in order to bring the "conservative" traditionalist into the fold. I think the more criminal activities with in the Karzai government  go further to harm Afghan progress. One thing that is enviably left out of the equation is the Pashtun desire for their own "nation" with in Afghanistan. A Pashtunistan. This also includes some of Pakistani border territory. 

Which Is why I believe the Vietnam style format of hunkering down in the urban centers and making forays into the rural  areas part of the problem.  Which [2] makes you wonder why the rural people accept the killing of Muslims in the name of a extremist Islamic interpretation and fight the progress of their National government. Standing against the extremist militants and supporting the National government would hurry along that much needed structure and improve their lives in their entirety. Which [3] proves the power of fear and propaganda as a volatile inhibitor keeping people from doing what is right and best for oneself and family. Instead of thriving the people dominated by the Taliban and their supporters are reduced to base survival imprisoned from participating in what is right and best for all human progress.